Relic cheese - it stinks!

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 10:20 am

well...doing a relic steal/defense is a personal choice, no one forces you to do it.

i can't believe what i'm hearing....no one can outcast from their faction because you think its wrong....thats sad. i have a char from every single faction, most are outcast because i don't like those faction i just couldn't make that build anywhere else. there is no "unaligned" faction with access to any build/class including PrC's. until someone imagines a way to do this without allowing cheesy super builds its not going to happen.

i say deal with it....there are always going to be traitors, there always was traitors. just because its something you don't like doesn't mean someone should be severly penalized(taken to lvl 1 and stripped of gear/char deleted) and forced to play in a faction they can't build their druid, ranger, pally, mage, rogue, RDD, Assassin, Shifter, CoT, Dwarven Defender, PM, or any other restricted class...its not going to happen.

seriouslynow · Post by **seriouslynow** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:26 am

As a new player to the server I admit, as soon as I heard SL had all the relics I quit playing my AO toon and made an SL one.
I can't wait to get high enough level to participate in relic battles because they sound fun. Almost like a built in DM event that happens spontaneously. What's better than that.

Celorn · Post by **Celorn** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:44 am

That's the problem... a bunch of good, dedicated players all jumped into SL together and threw the balance of power off in the server. LA and AO still have some good players, but they don't seem to be online quite as much than the SL people. Heck, everyone should join SL! then :DD: won't have any 'red' to kill anymore, won't that be grand.

As soon as new epic areas go in, I bet we will see a flood of high level players that have been on vacation for a long time and things will change again.

For now, I will probably be working more on my SL-based crafters since that seems to be the fastest way to levelup now.

TRAITORS:
I agree that something has to be done with faction traitors, i think an 500 pound, 8-slot, stone of shame is all we need (much like the 'Favour of Lloth' skull some of us were given the other night to waste even more of our time when we finally were getting relics back).

RELICS:
I agree, the relic system is simply a sure-fire way to get some PvP action in, and that's what a lot of SL people want. Instead, maybe they should be ignored and everyone hunt :DD: lowbies (don't forget about kst ones either) trying to level up fast with the xp bonus - and take lots of SShots while you do to get them banned if they relog other toons.

PeregrineV · Post by **PeregrineV** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:28 pm

JesterOI wrote:Possessing all the relics is only part of the game. It's there to entertain the higher level players.
Imagine how much XP you could have gotten had you went out levelling while all the big pvp builds are fighting over relics.

A lot less people out killing stuff because they fighting over flags means better spawns and better xp with a smaller threat of being randomly pk'd for you while levelling.

I can already tell you what it will be like without the relics. No bonus XP for ANYONE. Level 30's with nothing else better to do than run around looking for lowbies to harrass.

You wasted 2-3 hours of your time? For other people that was 2-3 hours of fun. It was 2-3 hours of lvl 30's being elsewhere besides poisoning lowbie levelling areas.

Hear, hear! Before I even finish reading all the posts, JesterOI is 100% correct.

PeregrineV · Post by **PeregrineV** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:40 pm

Not sure how this works, but could each character be given a "relic tag" of some sort, similar to the crafting? If you've "raided" (taken) or "captured" (returned to your cradle) a relic in the last X time period, you are not allowed to raid or maybe not allowed to pick up the relic.

The time X could slide with the charater level, the faction, the time of day, the class, the race, whatever, (or even be random?). This would make some of the relic raiding less predictable.

And Diviners might get greedy. Want gold or something for the information on where other relics are, or just gold, because you look rich you level 37 Paladin/RDD/Rogue/Monk/Bard/Wizard/Saucerer

/WM/SD.

Or something like that....

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:44 pm

why pay a diviner...just go to LA and get them when the high point of LB log off. head to AO when they leave in the wee hours of the morning..or run to SL if you think you can take on whoever is on at the time. if the relic is anywhere else just ask around i'm sure someone knows where it is.

oh and a new relic game is going to be log out a char right next to the relic so you can touch it and log out again....

kingfatzo · Post by **kingfatzo** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:21 pm

JesterOI wrote:Possessing all the relics is only part of the game. It's there to entertain the higher level players.
Imagine how much XP you could have gotten had you went out levelling while all the big pvp builds are fighting over relics.

A lot less people out killing stuff because they fighting over flags means better spawns and better xp with a smaller threat of being randomly pk'd for you while levelling.

I also feel that you wasted your time.

I can already tell you what it will be like without the relics. No bonus XP for ANYONE. Level 30's with nothing else better to do than run around looking for lowbies to harrass.

You wasted 2-3 hours of your time? For other people that was 2-3 hours of fun. It was 2-3 hours of lvl 30's being elsewhere besides poisoning lowbie levelling areas.

Stop complaining!

Well lets see here. I am in a Guild and my duties are to the Guild. This was the first instance that i felt the relic events were a complet waste of time... I wouldnt go leveling my lowbee while the rest of the guild is STRUGGLING to defend b/c of an imbalance YES I SAID IT AGAIN...
Yes, it would be boring w/o relics for the high lvls but if the proposed "new areas" open up then the high levels would indeed have somthing to do...
If i didnt consider it fun, i probably would have signed off in discust...i guess the word i wsa looking for was unproductive... hence stalemate.... casued by same-faction sellouts helping the enemy.

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:36 pm

lol..like i've never fought a faction traitor before...they key is to open up that little player menu and click them to dislike, that solves every problem you have. no matter what they do or where they go....you still dislike them.

Post by **Metis** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 3:01 pm

Back on topic even though I can't say I like the wording used.

Elagneros · Post by **Elagneros** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 4:29 pm

What annoys me the most is the immaturity.

I can deal with the normal faction vs. faction pvp content.

I can deal with DD parking on a big pile of relics if they took the effort to capture them, and if they are managing to effectively defend them. After all, there's been times when we managed to grab a nice chunk of relic action and held off those who wanted to take them from us. It does work both ways.

What I don't like is the immaturity, and the metagaming that comes out of the immature players. Using a toon to attack its own faction because you're sick of being beat up by defenders or losing items, or to avoid risk. Harassing and pking people, then taunting them until they curse at you in shout and/or tell, then sending screenshots to the DMs. Getting your buddies to attack a guild because a member of that guild pked you, the guild leader didn't take your side, and you want to hold a grduge (probably because you can't pk that person in the first place).

I'm not going to bother mentioning any names either. I'm sure most of us know who we're talking about here, and there's no real need to mention names except as flamebait.

Immaturity from players has caused problem before. Remember Nomius? Another classic case. There's a reason we have rule against repetative pking in a certain time peroid, revenge relogging, etc. These tactics do not make the game more enjoyable. And to be honest, the server has gotten better of late. Look how much we've been filled to capacity. I don't remember NS 4 ever being so popular before, and probably was only this full back when it first opened and the novelty hadn't worn off. When I first came in, there usually wasn't much more than about a dozen people on the server at once.

Bottom line, this is a great server, except when a small number of players come in and get their kicks from ruining everyone else's fun.

Post by **Metis** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:15 pm

I don't want to lock this post since I think constructive feedback helps everyone especialy since this is still relatively new.

I have deleted the off topic posts and future people, before just posting whats wrong try offer a solution even if it never gets used thoughtful attempts are at least appreciated as someone trying to improve this game for everyone.

lordvan52681 · Post by **lordvan52681** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:17 pm

Death Dealer1 wrote:lol..like i've never fought a faction traitor before...they key is to open up that little player menu and click them to dislike, that solves every problem you have. no matter what they do or where they go....you still dislike them.

the problem with this is that the server doesnt always recognize them as traitors, and if you open up before they do, youre now oucast.

This is what pisses me off about traitors. I could care less if you wanna be one, but I shouldnt be penalized for KoSing a traitor.

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:21 pm

i still handle it like a pro...if they shoot at me, its dislike and death. it doesn't get any simpler. if they are in your town and rumbling with others, they have already become outcasts and you treat them accordingly.

lordvan52681 · Post by **lordvan52681** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:27 pm

thats my point though. If you give a high lvl haracter the first shot, youre dead. And yet this is what i must do against you R or Chronepsis if i dont wanna become a traitor.

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 5:29 pm

chars like that, who on a constant basis attack inside their city limits are already traitors...it doesn't matter if you strike first or not.