"Pure" bardsong

[dethonlegs]

I've had some luck with wiz's VS shifters

[Daral0085]

Hey, this is *not* the thread for making reasonable suggestions or strategy tips for how to fight shifters. This is a thread for griping about how shifters are overpowered, and why pure fighters are the only viable build in all of AO/RK.

... although this thread is actually about pure bards, so it's kinda funny that people are using this as a stage for griping about shifters..... and 'people' really just means Mamba.

[Bargeld]

I'm betting you play shifters.

Yes it's off topic for this thread, but IMO its a valid topic.

[Daral0085]

Yes, I have several devastating shifter builds in the pipeline.

So, how about that pure bard nerf? I have an idea, you can use bards to help fight shifters. It's still an 8 point ac/ab swing with bard song/curse song. That knocks an 80 ac/60 ab shifter down to 72 ac/52 ab, which is actually somewhat on the weak side of builds.

Edit: you have my apologies for not playing a different faction. If it makes you feel better, I'm also building an NC cleric. I'm looking forward to imploding stuff.

[Bargeld]

Lol my toon with 78 ac and 58 ab got nerfed to armageddon, yet that is the low end of builds for you. Point in case that it deserves it's own topic.

There should be a good baseline like ab + ac = 130 or something, anything above that needs nerfing in one way or another.

[Rufio]

My harper scout has 82 ac and 68 ab self buffed with no items (or will in 3 levels when I finally get 40. It might happen one day) more damage output that my kobold shifter per hit and a plethora of other things that shifters can't do (use items, ranged weapons, spells, shield swap, spot most everything).

By these standards harper scouts should be nerfed too.

[Bargeld]

We don't get them either

So far, the best combo i can come up with in SL is 73 ab and 70 ac with a shortsword WM, which everyone else can get. (edit: 75 with a +4 book, bard doesn't matter cuz its all self buffed and caps already)

[Daral0085]

You can make them in MA, that should be good enough.

[BlkMamba]

Pure bards are still very viable
there still very good
and they will still be used
+4 ab/ac for a total of +8 if no bard is present on opposing side
is nothing to sneeze at

And i was commenting and responding to Doc's comment
and Linuxes comment

Wasnt trying to drag anything off topic
just keeping my words in content that it was intended

Mamba..

[Alkapwn]

It is only 1ac/ab loss. its not really a big deal. There's been way more painful nerfs in the past

[mining]

Well, shifters *somehow* still don't win every fight. By your cap PMs need nerfing too, as they can cap 80 AC and 60 AB self buffed. In addition, 65 AB/AC isn't really viable for PVP. How about HOgre WMs with 75+ AB, 60ish AC? They're needing nerfing too.

Also, there are SL/RK builds with comparable AB/AC to shifters, and by comparable I mean the same, but get better abilties in other areas. Shifters are only so 'good' because they tend towards doing what other builds do with a touch more versatility from the ability to get two stats moderately high. AO can make the HS build rufio is talking about with a very minor modification, and there are AO HS's with 70+ AB, 80+ AC possible.



Also, I would've liked to have posted a build like I did that high AC caster, but *some* people would strangle me. You'll just have to take my word for it.

[Daral0085]

Some people being your beloved factional allies; allies that are contingent on you not aiding or abetting factional enemies.

Lol my toon with 78 ac and 58 ab got nerfed to armageddon, yet that is the low end of builds for you. Point in case that it deserves it's own topic.

Not sure how I missed this one before, but you'll note I said 72 ac/52 ab, substantially weaker than your nerfed build. Anyway, I could post a 40 AB/40 AC build that got "nerfed" too, if I fit in EMA, so just saying that "my build got nerfed" does not mean it's overpowered, it just means you happened to use some feat/ability/spell/skill/class that was weakened. I'm sure there are dozens of underpowered or average builds that get nerfed every couple months whenever the devs are doing their job. My mediocre pure bard with substandard equipment just got nerfed. I guess that means that 70 AC and 50 AB is overpowered, and *everything must be weakened*. It's only fair.

I just thought of a couple other obvious counterpoints, but there's not much reason to argue this one out.

[Bargeld]

There should be a good baseline like ab + ac = 130 or something

I wasn't going to set the number myself, as I don't know about all the builds in other factions. I shot low in order to exaggerate, knowing how the devs love their nerf sticks.

And the build that I first compared to was "an 80 ac/60 ab shifter". I'm just pointing out that are still ongoing balance issues and the world of Aetheria is still a work in progress.

[Tsavong]

This stuff about shifters is all very interesting but what has it got to do with my bard and how awesome it was/is/might be?

If shifters are something that need talking about may be they should have a topic to talk about it instead of the end of a topic called "Pure" bardsong were it is off topic and may get lost or forgotten about.

[OpalimTeGolim]

My harper scout has 82 ac and 68 ab self buffed with no items (or will in 3 levels when I finally get 40. It might happen one day) more damage output that my kobold shifter per hit and a plethora of other things that shifters can't do (use items, ranged weapons, spells, shield swap, spot most everything).

By these standards harper scouts should be nerfed too.

Or maybe rangers or whatever other cheese you're using

I'm against nerfing something everyone has and can use. Bard nerf is bad because it introduces more imbalance in the game. Shifters are overpowered and they should be nerfed*.

* I just said this so mining can write something about DC 50+ fear aura